找回密码
 注册
搜索
楼主: google

严肃讨论,请置顶:黄金和死皮为什么分道扬镳?请教FA派,尤请学游,索螺丝

[复制链接]
发表于 2013-4-15 01:32 PM | 显示全部楼层


google 发表于 2013-4-15 01:21 PM
我的问题是,都说资金退出债券,进入股市,可是从SPX的量上得不到验证

至于是不是大顶,现在还没有证据 ...

首先,资金退出债券,进入股市,这是肯定的,因为资金没有其他去处了。因为经济不好,所有的都跌,除了股市被印钱推高。 但SPX没有验证。

我也有这个困惑,所以我只能猜测,难道现在板块分化很严重?SPX是指数,资金并不看好大盘指数了,而且介入一下具有投资价值的实体个股了?或者说,这时介入个股比投资指数有更大的获利?
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

 楼主| 发表于 2013-4-15 01:45 PM | 显示全部楼层
rightonmoney 发表于 2013-4-15 02:32 PM
首先,资金退出债券,进入股市,这是肯定的,因为资金没有其他去处了。因为经济不好,所有的都跌,除了股 ...


SPX的量应该是它的500个成分股量的总和吧?
SPY的量可能是单独的,但有关联,基本是同步的
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 01:46 PM | 显示全部楼层
google 发表于 2013-4-15 12:21 PM
我的问题是,都说资金退出债券,进入股市,可是从SPX的量上得不到验证

至于是不是大顶,现在还没有证据 ...

我觉得你的概念有误区。

1,Equity 的 Pool很大,而且不断地铺大饼。Spx的量只是相对Fund Equity 几乎可以忽略不计。
2,黄金贵还是死皮贵?贵就有泡沫,价格回归是必然。更合况美元是国际结算货币,如果无险可避,黄金和美元的相对价值也要回归。

SP500-gold.png


点评

有没有数据表明,Spx的量只是相对Fund Equity 几乎可以忽略不计. 不好意思,资金流属于FA,我误闯禁地了。  发表于 2013-4-15 06:39 PM
我的了解,目前Equity的Dark Pool大约70%,但那是超级主力为了不影响市场的无奈。不知我理解是否对。我研究资金流。  发表于 2013-4-15 06:34 PM
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

 楼主| 发表于 2013-4-15 01:49 PM | 显示全部楼层
ctcld 发表于 2013-4-15 02:46 PM
我觉得你的概念有误区。

1,Equity 的 Pool很大,而且不断地铺大饼。Spx的量只是相对Fund Equity 几乎 ...

我看的不是绝对的量,我看的是相对的量
如果有新资金进入的话,至少下个月比上个月量应该逐渐增加吧,也就是量应该逐
步上升,而不是现在逐步走低的趋势
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 01:57 PM | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 ctcld 于 2013-4-15 12:59 PM 编辑
google 发表于 2013-4-15 12:49 PM
我看的不是绝对的量,我看的是相对的量
如果有新资金进入的话,至少下个月比上个月量应该逐渐增加吧,也 ...

FUND 的 Portfolios 不能直接反映在 Spx的量上

这里有一篇上个月的ML的动态

Where to invest as money flows back to stocks: B. of. A.
March 13, 2013, 5:30 PM
Four years after stocks hit bottom to rally back to pre-crash levels, Bank of America Merrill Lynch is advising investors to be a little more picky about what to have in their portfolios in the spring as money begins to flow back into equities.

The firm is still bullish on stocks even while it acknowledges they’re vulnerable to a pullback in the first half of the year. After all, the Dow Jones Industrial Average DJIA -1.12%  ended Wednesday with its longest winning streak since 1996 with 9 gaining sessions in a row.

About $30 billion has flowed into long-position stock funds since Thanksgiving, following a $550 billion exodus since 2006, and Merrill’s sell-side indicator has fallen below 50 for the first time in seven months, suggesting positive returns in equities over the next 12 months, said Kate Moore, global equity strategist at B. of A. Merrill Lynch, in a note.

Global central bank liquidity has also jumped to $21 trillion from $8 trillion over the past six years with no signs of slowing, further propping up stocks, while corporate profits are expected to grow by 10% this year, she said.

So what is B. of A. Merrill Lynch suggesting for pickier investors? Japanese equities, housing stocks, tech, and exposure to copper.

The firm expects Japanese equities to rise more, getting a turbocharge from cheap money as the Bank of Japan takes more aggressive easing measures along the lines of those pursued by the Federal Reserve and European Central Bank. The Nikkei 225 JP:100000018 -1.37%  is already up 18% this year. As for the U.S. housing market, the firm expects housing prices nationally to rise 8% this year as inventory declines.

B. of A. Merrill Lynch also likes tech because of “attractive valuations, clean balance sheets, cash deployment opportunities and foreign exposure” and the fact the sector’s bringing up the rear on the S&P 500 SPX -1.45%  this year with only a 3.7% gain. As for copper, the firm expects a small deficit in the industrial metal this year so copper mining stocks could benefit. Miners with copper exposure include Freeport McMoRan Copper & Gold Inc. FCX -7.71% , Southern Copper Corp. SCCO -7.27% , and Teck Resources Ltd. TCK -9.19%

Below is a table from B. of A. Merrill Lynch on year-to-date returns across asset classes:

Global Equities 6.4%
US 9.3%
Europe 4.4%
UK 1.6%
Japan 6.9%
Pacific Rim ex-Japan 8.1%
Emerging Markets 1.3%
Global Fixed Income -2.7%
Government -4.1%
US Treasuries -1.1%
Quasi-government -2.3%
Investment Grade Corporate -1.8%
High Yield Corporate 1.7%
EM Corporate Debt 0.3%
Collateralized Debt -0.6%
US Mortgage Backed Securities -0.5%
Commodities 1.4%
Energy 4.4%
Industrial Metals -4.1%
Precious Metals -5.7%
Agriculture -2.2%
Cash 0.0%
US Dollar 5.5%
–Wallace Witkowski
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 02:05 PM | 显示全部楼层
One word, the de-risk of USD.
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 02:07 PM | 显示全部楼层
大家全错了,实际是大庄逃顶。专业说法
获利了解。
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

 楼主| 发表于 2013-4-15 02:10 PM | 显示全部楼层
revolver 发表于 2013-4-15 03:05 PM
One word, the de-risk of USD.

左轮,你也多说几句,把观点讲清楚
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 02:38 PM | 显示全部楼层
google 发表于 2013-4-15 02:10 PM
左轮,你也多说几句,把观点讲清楚

I see it from 3 perspectives.

1. The FX risks are getting lower now among the several major currencies as the policies of major central banks are all on the tables. US is committed to maintain QE until the employment recovers in a sustained way. Japan is committed to maintain QE until the inflation rate reaches 2%. Europe and UK are also committed to QE with certain targets clearly communicated to or interpreted by investors.

2. The risk of equity and bond in all major developed markets are getting lower with the borrowing cost so cheap and flooded liquidity.

3. The inflation risk is far from happening.
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 02:49 PM | 显示全部楼层
While FED is printing big way and telling market up front that it will not stop until the job market gets a sustainable recovery, Japan, Europe and UK are set to disallow USD depreciating against their own currencies. If this is the case then FED will continue to pump money which in turn reduces the borrowing cost and inflate all risk asset prices including stocks and bonds. The US equity market boom is not because growth or technological advance but liquidity.
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 04:03 PM | 显示全部楼层
google 发表于 2013-4-15 01:45 PM
SPX的量应该是它的500个成分股量的总和吧?
SPY的量可能是单独的,但有关联,基本是同步的

应该不是500个成分股量的总和, 你看看单位就知道了。

是不是和SPX一样,加权平均,就不确定了。 但SPX的量几乎很均等,看不出特别的作用。
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 04:26 PM | 显示全部楼层
本帖最后由 jamesmith 于 2013-4-15 04:30 PM 编辑

S&P and economy are correlated? not really...at least not in the short to mid term...

gdp.png
US Real GDP

sp.png
S&P

and gold is a commodity.  
printing money = gold must go up?

The price of gold remained remarkably stable for long periods of time. For example, Sir Isaac Newton, as master of the U.K.
Mint, set the gold price at L3.17s. 10d. per troy ounce in 1717, and it remained effectively the same for two hundred years until
1914. The only exception was during the Napoleonic wars from 1797 to 1821. The official U.S. Government gold price has
changed only four times from 1792 to the present. Starting at $19.75 per troy ounce, raised to $20.67 in 1834, and $35 in
1934. In 1972, the price was raised to $38 and then to $42.22 in 1973. A two-tiered pricing system was created in 1968, and
the market price for gold has been free to fluctuate since then as the table below shows.

Gold price from 1833 to present:  http://www.nma.org/pdf/gold/his_gold_prices.pdf

gold.JPG

评分

1

查看全部评分

回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 04:36 PM | 显示全部楼层
google 发表于 2013-4-15 12:49 AM
有一种交易策略,也就是不管黄金,股市的涨跌是真是假,两个一起空

主席, 美国已经答应德国了, 7年内把人家存在美国的300吨黄金还回去。


我个人的猜测啊, 这几年,黄金是涨不了了。

回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 05:08 PM | 显示全部楼层
google 发表于 2013-4-15 01:49 PM
我看的不是绝对的量,我看的是相对的量
如果有新资金进入的话,至少下个月比上个月量应该逐渐增加吧,也 ...


我证实主席说的对,

我的程序显示,SP Future For Jun 13,2013的某资金流指标,已经在3月12日到达峰值38000,
降到目前8500,所以我已经于4月4日在SP为1560时撤退,并且广而告之,不是马后炮,当然也没有卖在最高点。

但请主席观察一下IWM吧。如果有空,明天我会在原创区发个图, 那里冷清,大家都有责任舞文弄墨。

我当然在研究资金退出债券的所有可能去向,因为事关我们的可能交易,和自己程序或者数据源的可能错误,就不多说了。

至于黄金吗,我考虑一下。此前抄底请慎重,没有老蛇那两下子的胡同居民, 还是看老蛇的Markets Review吧。
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 05:37 PM | 显示全部楼层
看看楼下QWE的”金子大跌,是央行砸的,为了保美元地位,很绝望的动作“的video,我觉得有道理。。。
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 06:52 PM | 显示全部楼层
google 发表于 2013-4-15 12:49 PM
我看的不是绝对的量,我看的是相对的量
如果有新资金进入的话,至少下个月比上个月量应该逐渐增加吧,也 ...

回主席和九天:这是我看到的,这些都是在2级市场上完成交易的,不影响指数。

"So far in 2013 over $60 billion in net new money has come into equity mutual funds, breaking an almost two-year stretch of outflows.  Two-thirds of that has gone, as usual, into global etc. funds.

Much more interesting, to my mind, but almost completely unnoticed, is the HUGE outflow of over $112 billion from equity funds that occurred last year, from August through December."
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

 楼主| 发表于 2013-4-15 07:17 PM | 显示全部楼层
ctcld 发表于 2013-4-15 07:52 PM
回主席和九天:这是我看到的,这些都是在2级市场上完成交易的,不影响指数。

"So far in 2013 over $6 ...

但这个还是没有解释为什么SPX的量在逐月下降
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 07:20 PM | 显示全部楼层
一个交易品价格的上涨下跌,本质来说只有一个,买盘卖盘力量的冲击。一切消息面都是遮羞的内衣裤。

想要看到内衣裤里面的东西就不能局限于内衣裤本身。而要注意买者卖者的真实意图。美股就是个各方资金博弈的战场,而黄金市场的背景则不一样,甚至带有政治性的,可以是国与国之间的博弈,奸猾的商人总想打击几千年不衰的货币来抬举自己发行不到两百年的纸钞。
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

发表于 2013-4-15 07:28 PM | 显示全部楼层
google 发表于 2013-4-15 07:17 PM
但这个还是没有解释为什么SPX的量在逐月下降

从数论的角度讲,一个交易品的价格在低位时,同样的资金流通可以造出巨大的量,而价格越升越高后,每单位承载的资金就多,同样的资金能带动的量也就小了。

一个农民可以背起200个玉米苗,可当玉米长成后也许就只能背起50个了,农民的力量保持不变。

这只是个解释得通的说法,可能不是是真正原因。
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

 楼主| 发表于 2013-4-15 08:09 PM | 显示全部楼层
jackie8443 发表于 2013-4-15 08:28 PM
从数论的角度讲,一个交易品的价格在低位时,同样的资金流通可以造出巨大的量,而价格越升越高后,每单位 ...

我觉得交易量是以资金衡量的,不是股数计算的
回复 鲜花 鸡蛋

使用道具 举报

您需要登录后才可以回帖 登录 | 注册

本版积分规则

手机版|小黑屋|www.hutong9.net

GMT-5, 2024-11-14 04:22 PM , Processed in 0.059092 second(s), 20 queries .

Powered by Discuz! X3.5

© 2001-2024 Discuz! Team.

快速回复 返回顶部 返回列表